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Post by Bymaria on Feb 28, 2018 22:54:58 GMT
This Order has been withdrawn before becoming law, in favour of a new Executive Order issued here. With the passing of the Executive Action Amendment, I am now permitted to draft an Executive Order, which I am able to make law. This is the first time I am using this power, having been more reserved with it up until now. I’m interested in thoughts on it before officialising this.
Good people of Londinium, Many know that we are a region of fairness. After all... our recruitment telegram states that in Londinium you become the leader; that “ you will not be dictated to by existing Lords or region elders”. This really is something I believe in, but unfortunately, our Roleplay sector (now a major regional attraction) does not share this value of equality that is presented so well by the rest of the region. Having promised you a fairer region I am disappointed with this. We can see that there is no apparent structure to how the head of Roleplay (HoR) is chosen and it seems that only the recognised “roleplaying elders” (Oh hi Hrist and Destiny) have complete influence over what happens in this area. I firmly believe that any talented individual within our region absolutely should not be denied an opportunity to become HoR. We need to introduce elections to make this plausible. We need to democratise Roleplay in order to act in common interests, additional to improving everyone’s experience and make a Roleplay that works for the people who play it, not only for those who have been around longest. This will allow more people to share their ideas on what the next RP should be and how it should be implemented. It gives people a say in their experience and make change when things are unsatisfactory. In such progressive spirits, I have decided to take the following action, through Executive Order, to make a difference:
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Post by United Barbaros on Feb 28, 2018 23:41:39 GMT
By doing this, the government is intervening into RP business. Even though we are a region that sports RP, and that regulations for RP can be implemented, it should not be through government action. I believe RP and government business should remain separate. Also, this move doesn't seem to be as democratic as it may appear. Nothing against you Bymaria. I say this is undemocratic mainly because a few members, including our monarch and myself, have stated that either we do not want our government involved in RP. Others have said they don't want an elected HoRP. I'm not completely against electing HoRPs, but I am against using an executive order to do so. That should be sorted out and decided upon in areas for RP discussion, not by government means and intervention.
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Post by United Barbaros on Mar 1, 2018 0:16:58 GMT
Constitutionally, per Article VII section 4, I don't think this executive order can pass, as it must be according to the will of the people, and I haven't seen much agreement concerning this discussion about electing HoRPs.
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Post by Nyelant on Mar 1, 2018 0:44:03 GMT
Because of the controversy regarding this issue, I'm not going to be commenting on this. I'm not sure whether it breaks any rules, as we don't have a clear picture as to whether it is in the will of the people. It seems to be only the actual Heads of Roleplay who object, in their attempt to keep hold of power. I'm indifferent as to this issue; I assume business as usual either way.
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Post by Sopo on Mar 1, 2018 4:30:25 GMT
I do not think an executive order is the right move here. This matter was not urgent and could have been decided by the Assembly or Parliament.
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Post by germanempire on Mar 1, 2018 6:39:47 GMT
I am against this EO as well!
Hristijan and I have taken on many issues to make the roleplay possible , it is our creation , our effort and not the regions. The monarch himself said that the RP is definetly split from the government and therefore ungovernable. There is a working structure in place that does its job as the creators intended and if this is a Problem we can discuss it , or you can leave, simple as that. Forcing something that is officialy split from the region to be governed because on has the Power ? I disagree with this dictatorial EO deeply.
Also , you cannot take or change something you do not posses , for it is the heads of roleplays work and their work only to be desided upon.espacialy Hristijan, and taking this away border on redistribution in communistic Russia or the soviet Union.
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 9:49:52 GMT
By doing this, the government is intervening into RP business. Even though we are a region that sports RP, and that regulations for RP can be implemented, it should not be through government action. I believe RP and government business should remain separate. I see what you’re saying, but the way this currently seems to work - under the absolute control of Nesearan and German Empire - would mean implementing these regulations through Roleplay would not be possible. This means (not only that people can choose their Roleplay and it’s head) but also that we have a clear system and rules for making changes in the future, in which everyone has a say. I don’t think it’s bad that this is through government intervention, since it’s the proper way to do things and does keep IC RP separate from government. This changes only basic workings of our Roleplay and has no direct IC impact. I'm not completely against electing HoRPs, but I am against using an executive order to do so. That should be sorted out and decided upon in areas for RP discussion, not by government means and intervention. Perhaps a consensus in the Assembly would have been wise, however it is not possible for this to be achieved in parliament, as some of the heads of Roleplay and people close to them have control. This is using government intervention once - where necessary and not unjustified - but ensures that government and roleplaying will still be separate and that these elections take place in the Roleplay forums.
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 10:08:59 GMT
I am against this EO as well! Hristijan and I have taken on many issues to make the roleplay possible , it is our creation , our effort and not the regions. First of all, you come across as extremely possessive here. Second of all, this Roleplay is not just your work and that seems like a major insult to all who contribute to making our Roleplay work. You are part of the region, aren’t you? So how does that make it your work and not that of the region? I don’t think that’s very reasonable and actually makes me think you do not work on the Roleplay for the region, but for yourself. A HoR is for all roleplayers to decide, not just you and Hristijan. I am sure that many people are grateful for what you have done for the Roleplay, but that simply doesn’t mean you get to hold on to power forever and that nobody else gets a say in how things work. The monarch himself said that the RP is definetly split from the government and therefore ungovernable. Okay, so Fortwhile may have said that the two should be separate, but that does not mean RP is disconnected to the entire region. Roleplay takes place in this region’s forums! It is a different thing to government, but that does not mean we cannot make changes to how it works. I’d like to stress that this is not merging the two and that these elections take place in the Roleplay forums - not in the government ones. There is a working structure in place that does its job as the creators intended and if this is a Problem we can discuss it , or you can leave, simple as that. Forcing something that is officialy split from the region to be governed because on has the Power ? Working system? There is no system! That’s the reason for this change. As I said to Barbaros, government intervention here is necessary, but is not merging the two or making any IC change, so the two are still separate. And he thing is, no one should be forced to leave when they’re unhappy with something they cannot change. They deserve a say and a chance to become HoR theirselves. We have already had one person leave the Roleplay from being unsatisfied and irritated with what they felt helpless over. Also , you cannot take or change something you do not posses , for it is the heads of roleplays work and their work only to be desided upon.espacialy Hristijan You see you’ve called this dictatorial (when it’s introducing democracy) when you clearly need to hang on to your own power in this area. A Roleplay would not work with only the heads and so I do believe that any talented individual capable of making a Roleplay should not be denied the opportunity. You each are still capable of being elected, therefore I can’t see a personal problem.
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 10:15:01 GMT
It is important to realise that this action does not affect IC matters and that this is the proper way to bring about change to something rather than using the current “system” in which Roleplay is decided upon. We had some great suggestions for making Roleplay fair from a visitor to the region on discord, which were shut down immediately by certain people with influence after it was suggested they be tried. Elections allow people to understand what each candidate stands for and choose what they prefer.
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Post by United Barbaros on Mar 1, 2018 10:40:31 GMT
Bymaria Remember that anything done now will set a precedent for the future. Just because this is meant to be a one time thing it doesn't mean it will stay that way. I don't disagree with everything you are saying. I'm not against bringing more democratic processes into roleplays. However, an executive order is not the way to do it, especially one that is undemocratic and IMO unconstitutional. Government is not the only effective way of changing roleplay, and assuming it is is not checking out all options. You're saying that government will only have a small say in roleplay, but that's only now. Again, this sets a precedent for the future, and can open the door to more government involvement in roleplay. Besides, in roleplay is mainly for fun, and has no bearing on what happens in our region. Government, on the contrary, is for the service of our region. They are two separate fields of activity. Some people like roleplay because it is separate from government business. Roleplay should not have to be connected in any way with government just because something couldn't be figured out right away in roleplay discussions. If you want to be democratic, encourage open discussion about concerns with roleplay. Ask people who agree with you to boycott. Think of solutions that people, including the current HoRPs, might agree to. With this executive order, you seem to be acting in a similar fashion as those you accuse. You accuse them of being undemocratic and putting their ideas/intentions first, but that's exactly what you're doing with this executive order. I don't mean to insult or offend, but this is what I see.
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 10:56:40 GMT
I don’t see how I could be viewed as acting out of self-interest. I’m organising the Modern Roleplay, and have influence over lots more under this system more than others. That is what I do not like. The HoR should be for all Roleplayers to have a say in, not just a few. I have no intentions to be elected HoR after the 2018 Roleplay, though if I did that wouldn’t matter, since it makes it fairer for everyone. And as I’ve said it is part of Londinium - quite a big part now - and does affect people. It’s not an entirely independent thing controlled by just certain unelected people. The government’s job is to make sure the region is functioning properly and change it for the better. Why should that stop at RP?
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 11:02:44 GMT
This isn’t official yet and - in large part - I did this to get people talking. We need some way to improve the RP and make its heads more accountable. If there are better suggestions I am open to them. But not to the present so-called “system”.
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Post by United Barbaros on Mar 1, 2018 11:15:20 GMT
I never said self-interest, especially since this EO is supposed to favor all. However, if you implement this EO, you are trying to using your PM power with little or no regard to the opinions of those who have mentioned disagreement with the idea it enforces, including the monarch and myself. Because of this, I consider it unconstitutional.
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Post by germanempire on Mar 1, 2018 12:23:57 GMT
I agree with @barbaros here. This move is unconditional and highly doubious hence as I said before the government has no say in things that do not impact the way the region works. And yes I am possesive of a creation of mine (partly of mine and partly of other) , since I want to keep it the Proper way it is intended and that is not the 100% democratic way! The HoRp are oveeseers and a guidance for decisions thar act in favour of the roleplay. There were proposals made by me that were ignored on how to implement a certain degree of democracy. I allways said that the HoRp are there to Guard their creation and to help it prevail, not dictate (which they never do , they get together and deside what is the most practicaly solution)
Also I never said anything about "forced" to leave , I said if one does not want to discuss properly (like you do with this unconditional EO) and want to force their will on someone elses creation, they can leave. Btw, it is obviously not only the work of Hristijan and me ,but many people - under our guidance of our Vision.
I will submit my proposal this evening (18:00 GMT+1) that I made long ago that was ignored totaly. But I will never accept unconditional government interference in non government matters and condem the abuse of Power.
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Post by Bymaria on Mar 1, 2018 16:07:05 GMT
RP is not disconnected to the entire region. Roleplay takes place in this region’s forums! It is a different thing to government, but that does not mean we cannot make changes to how it works. I’d like to stress that this is not merging the two and that these elections take place in the Roleplay forums - not in the government ones. There is nothing preventing the government legislating on how Roleplay should work. Just because you’ve said it’s “yours”, doesn’t make it so and it is still a part of the region and under the influence of its government. I’ll await your suggestion, then.
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